Phil is kidnapped by the DRC

Date: 2003-12-15, from 16:00 until 18:00
Location: Ae’gura
Logged By: Almlys

[Phil is exploring in the Guild Hall]

phend:
up high
Domahreh:
cool :)
Domahreh:
Rudenna?
Domahreh:
Is that where you are?
Domahreh:
I can’t see anyone from the courtyard floor…
The Psion:
I’ll catch everyone later, have a lovely night
Daedalus:
can you tell us where you are, phil?
Brian Fioca:
near the bridge?
phend:
no, up higher
Domahreh:
Phil, are you in the bahro cave? The one that overlooks the great lake?
phend:
bye Douglas
Brian Fioca:
Phil, the way is blocked, i think
phend:
you can’t come here
Domahreh:
How did you get there, if we can’t come?
phend:
it’s difficult
Domahreh:
the journey to where you are is difficult?
phend:
but it’s amazing
Domahreh:
Is Doug there with you, Phil?
Daedalus:
can you clear a path for us phil?
Domahreh:
(poor guy getting barraged with questions… )
phend:
the Great King was buried here
phend:
the Great King was buried here
Domahreh:
The temple!
Pa’lua:
Phil, do you have a message from Yeesha?
Domahreh:
and that’s where the great zero is, isn’t it?
Daedalus:
the Guild house?
Domahreh:
Oh, that might be it… He did establish the guild system…
phend:
this is good - this place
plinthon:
“this is starting to resemble cult behavior Mulder!”
phend:
yes
Domahreh:
The Guild House, Phil?
Pa’lua:
Phil, when will be able to see the Guild house?
plinthon:
“the voice from above spoke to me scully!”
phend:
i only am standing here - beneath it
Domahreh:
Engberg’s here!
Pa’lua:
Phil, are you in the Hall of Kings?
phend:
no - i am up beneath the guild hall
Tutelary:
Which is the guild hall?
an’nie:
where is the guild hall??
phend:
it is the place of the king - his tomb
Domahreh:
Anyone have the Dakota notebooks memorized/handy?
Tutelary:
Top, bottom?
an’nie:
please help us Phil we want to see you
Domahreh:
The guild hall was built on top of the tomb
theGreatTree:
the round building that has the front covered and blocked off?
Domahreh:
so if he’s in the tomb, he’s beneath the guild hall, but still above us on the courtyard…
phend:
he will return
Domahreh:
Who? The Great King?
Daedalus:
who… the king?
Pa’lua:
Which king will return Phil?
Tutelary:
Where is the tomb?
plinthon:
Elvis?
Domahreh:
That’s preposterous, it flies in the face of millenia of D’ni culture…
Jeff K.:
IIRC, The tomb of the Great King is where the Terahnee book was stored.
plinthon:
Brian will be happy if ELvis returns
phend:
Douglas should return to see this - where did he go?
Jeff K.:
According to the stories of Atrus.
Domahreh:
(I thought that was in the tomb of Ahlsendar?)
Jeff K.:
He was the Great King.
Domahreh:
No, Kerath was the Great King, I thought.
theGreatTree:
looks like douglas is in realto
Domahreh:
Ack, I’ve gotta run…
Pa’lua:
Victor Laxan is in the Nexus.
Domahreh:
You’re right!
Domahreh:
My bad.
Domahreh:
bye all – hope phil opens up a bit… :)
theGreatTree:
phil, are you somewhere that we can get to?
phend:
this is where he was - i feel the honor of this place
Pa’lua:
Phil, I have to say, all this mystery is getting a little tiresome.
plinthon:
indeed
Tutelary:
Phil - why should we side with Yeesha? What reasons can you give us?
plinthon:
where is the DRC when you need them!
Pa’lua:
Victor Laxman is in the Nexus, but I don’t know where he’ll link to.
phend:
because she knows more
Tutelary:
Knows more about what?
Pa’lua:
Phil, that’s what you keep saying, but we’ve not seen any proof.
phend:
knows more than all of us - who would know more than her?
Equisilus:
I once knew something. But I forgot what it was.
Tutelary:
That’s being pretty vague, and it almost sounds like you’re trying to deify her
Tutelary:
Does Yeesha want our support or our worship? She does share Gehn’s blood, after all
phend:
no - do you deify your parents? They know more than their child
Daedalus:
can you teach us, Phil?
Tutelary:
But you talk about her knowledge almost as if it’s omniscience.
Tutelary:
Maybe Dr Watson will be kind enough to chip in?
phend:
I don’t know more than her, but she does not know all
phend:
oh, hello Dr. Watson. how are you
Dr Watson:
I’m doing fine. Phil. It’s been a while. Glad to hear you’re back.
Pa’lua:
Mr. Laxman is here, does anyone know where he’s at?
Tutelary:
Maybe Dr Watson can explain why we should support the DRC and not Yeesha? Likewise you Phil - you’ve still not given us a good reason why we should support you and Yeesha.
phend:
yes. my journey continues. today i have seen even more.
phend:
where are you Dr. Watson?
Pa’lua:
Mr. Engberg, how are you?
Dr Watson:
I’m helping inspect an area near the bridge, Phil.
phend:
i’m near the guild hall
biLLyat:
follow a shaved’head tattooed 250yr old hippie?
phend:
near the tomb
Tutelary:
Why don’t you both come and see the people?
Dr Watson:
I’ve heard. That isn’t the safest of places to be, you know.
phend:
i feel him here
phend:
the safety doesn’t matter
Dr Watson:
it matters to me.
phend:
i know - i’m sorry
Dr Watson:
we’ve already lost you once from lack of following safety procedures.
phend:
yes, but that was good
Tutelary:
Where is that, Pa’lua
phend:
it was good
phend:
it had to be - for my journey - and i was safe
Dr Watson:
I’m not so sure. And even if it was, you might not be so lucky the next time.
phend:
sometimes it’s luck, and sometimes it’s not
Tutelary:
You guys sure are good at avoiding the question :P
Beatfox:
does anyone see where Watson & Phil are?
biLLyat:
beats me beatfox
biLLyat roars with laughter
phend:
Tutelary - you are good at avoiding the answer
Tutelary:
I’m a philosophy graduate, so I tend to be sceptical about there being one :P
Pa’lua:
See the bridge over there Beatfox? Dr Watson is inspecting that… Phil is in the Guild Hall and we can’t get there either.
phend:
are there no answers?
phend:
that you can accept?
Beatfox:
Phil, many of us have been seeking them
Beatfox:
but we have great difficulty finding any
Tutelary:
I wouldn’t go that far, but there are questions that have no answer, and answers that have no questions. I get the impression you’re trying to give us an answer while avoid us having to ask the right questions
Pa’lua:
Phil, I realize you think you are giving us answers, but they are too vague and confusing for us to understand.
Tutelary:
To understand the answers though, we need to know the questions.
Tutelary:
Otherwise it’s just words.
biLLyat:
that bridge has seen better days
phend:
what is your question?
Brian Fioca:
Phil, does Yeesha have the answers?
phend:
yes
Pa’lua:
Yes, there used to be a wooden and rope bridge that spanned the broken parts, but it’s gone now.
Brian Fioca:
when will she give them to us?
Tutelary:
What does Yeesha want from us? What can she give us, and what does she expect in return?
Pa’lua:
Dr. Watson, how does the bridge look?
Mils:
hey greenguy i see you jumping over the barrier :)
biLLyat:
how are they gunna close the gap?
Mils:
it works?
plinthon shakes her head
plinthon:
crazy mad
Daedalus:
lol
phend:
that is a long answer, with many parts. and you know some of the answer already.
biLLyat:
don’t want one of those Cleft style rope bridges
Pa’lua:
I don’t know…
Dr Watson:
I’m sure it’s looked better. At the moment it needs a great deal of work.
biLLyat:
they aren’t safe – i found out
plinthon:
laa laa
Tutelary:
Avoiding the questionb again, Phil.
Greenguy:
works well
Tutelary:
I want to want to support you, but I have so little to go on.
phend:
i will answer with what you know - she wants you to know what D’ni was…
Daedalus:
Phil - will you teach us?
Tutelary:
But she is more than the D’ni ever was?
phend:
…she wants you to understand what power does - the power of the books
Pa’lua:
Dr. Watson, I’d like to help with the Great Zero restoration….we heard from Mr. Laxman that you were considering letting us help.
Jeff K.:
Indeed. What is this Great Zero exactly? Some kind of positioning system?
Beatfox:
Phil, not to sound rude, but… how are we to know that her intentions are truly noble?
Tutelary:
Does she want us to understand the powe of the D’ni’s books, or her books?
Brian Fioca:
is the power of the books in danger?
plinthon:
The DRC are doing a fantastic job Dr Watson. I”m glad to be a part of it all! the wonder of it all is awe inspiring!
an’nie:
We want to help, please let us!
phend:
all the books, the power is dangerous
Brian Fioca:
are the DRC trying to keep the power of the books for them selves
Daedalus:
how can we use her teachings, Phil?
phend:
don’t you understand that?
plinthon:
if you need any support in any way…. just ask us… i’m sure there is plenty of explorers willing to go the extra mile for the DRC
phend:
she was clear
Dr Watson:
Pa’lua, Yes, Mr. Laxman believes that there will be a way for you to help.
Tutelary:
Can Yeesha teach us how to write? Safely, of course. To better understand the books.
phend:
why?
Jeff K.:
I heard that once the DRC knows enough about the books, the plan on trying to write them.
an’nie:
Dr Watson can we all help!!??
Dr Watson:
brian, the DRC wants no such thing. We’re just trying to be deliberate in our restoration efforts.
Pa’lua:
Dr. Watson, there are many of us that believe we can help you with the restoration, and would like to be given the chance to do so.
phend:
can you handle it? have you shown her that?
an’nie:
yes we can handle it
Beatfox:
Phil, I agree with Yeesha in that the power of the books is one that can easily be abused… yet how are we to know that she may not unknowingly do the same?
Pa’lua:
Phil, we can hardly show Yeesha anything….she’s never around.
Tutelary:
Has she earned the right for me to show her anything? She has shown me nothing, except how to use me unwittingly.
Beatfox:
She has been known to boast about her abilities
Brian Fioca:
Phil, what can we do to help, once we’ve gathered?
Jeff K.:
Yes, I would have liked a bit more information on her Bahro campaign than she offered me.
phend:
she has shown you nothing?
Brian Fioca:
She has shown us much, but there is much we don’t understand it seems
Dr Watson:
Pa’lua, we are looking for ways that you can contribute.
phend:
maybe others have seen more
Daedalus:
she has shown us how the power of the books can be abused
Tutelary:
Yes, she has shown me nothing worth seeing. Except the potential she promise.
Jeff K.:
Well, not nothing, but I felt like I was blindly following her orders. That makes me rather uncomfortable.
Beatfox:
She has shown us many things, yet she hasn’t show us the evidence we need in order to trust her
Brian Fioca:
the Bahro?
Pa’lua:
Thank you Dr. Watson, we appreciate the opportunity.
Brian Fioca:
she has shown us the Bahro
Daedalus:
how people can mistreat the books for their own purposes, outside of what they know is right
phend:
perhaps you see what you want to - or don’t want to
Tutelary:
She used us with the Bahro. I want to know what purpose I was used for.
Tutelary:
I want to see clearly, yet I see only words of smoke and mirrors.
phend:
you can not see clearly yet. so while you see dimly - only trust fills in the blank spaces
Beatfox:
Phil, this is an issue of utmost importance we’re talking about here… we need real, solid facts so that we can make the right decisions intelligently
Jeff K.:
Well, I trust Yeesha to know what she’s doing and to do the right thing.
an’nie:
We have a choice…….our power of free will is valuable too…we are a resource you can tap into…….will you????
Brian Fioca:
so we must decide who we trust
Beatfox:
we don’t have enough for us to go on using simple trust
phend:
that is how life is - we can never see everything. So we choose what to trust.
Tutelary:
Trust must be earned. Otherwise it is unwise to give it
an’nie:
and they must decide if they trust us
Jeff K.:
It’s just the Bahro gave me an uneasy feeling. Probably just my instincts.
phend:
can it be earned completely?
Tutelary:
Never, but it can be earned.
Daedalus:
it takes someething beyond trust, Phil
Tutelary:
Yeesha can not trust us until she gives us a chance to show that we are worthy of her trust.
Beatfox:
I feel like not enough has been done to deserve our trust
phend:
so you must weigh - based on partial knowlege - who you will trust
Pa’lua:
Dr. Watson, I am looking to the right of the bridge, in a split between the rock and I think I see a light mounted on a domed building.
Tutelary:
Then I can only conclude that I trust myself, and no other.
Brian Fioca:
well, yeesha has given us the most knowledge so far
phend:
there will be a magic line that you will cross - and then trust will happen?
Daedalus:
Phil – it is more than that
phend:
if you trust only yourself then you will fail
Jeff K.:
Well, I trust the DRC to make D’ni safe for us, and I trust Yeesha to rectify the D’ni’s past.
Brian Fioca:
we are powerless alone
Tutelary:
If what you say is true, when I creoss that line I will simply know who to trust. My chance of failure is greater if I give in to blind trust of people I do not know.
Jeff K.:
I mean, her own grandfater was an example of what excessive pride and the power of the books can do together.
phend:
yes
Beatfox:
Phil… I trust Atrus… and from his letter, it appeared that he was beginning to lost trust in Yeesha
Jeff K.:
Not to mention her brothers…
Tutelary:
Where is Atrus now?
Jeff K.:
I think he’s dead.
Tutelary:
Never! :P He ‘ll carry on forever, like the Queen…
phend:
but be careful of what you think you must know - sometimes it simply lets you trust only in yourself
Tutelary:
Hi Douglas. What’s your take on this trust debate?
Jeff K.:
Yes, but Atrus never had cybernetic parts! :-)
Tutelary:
I must know what will happen to me if I trust wisely, and what will happen if I trust unwisely.
Brian Fioca:
why would anyone ever trust unwisely?
Beatfox:
if that trust leads to destruction
phend:
you will never KNOW
Pa’lua:
Brian, you wouldn’t ask that question if you’d ever met my ex=husband.
Daedalus:
we are not mind readers
an’nie:
trust can be built with small steps….
Beatfox:
Phil, throughout our life we have trusted in many people… and many times, that trust has led to destruction
Tutelary:
What is knowledge except true, justtified belief? You want our belief, we want justificascation. Only time will tell if there is truth.
Beatfox:
we don’t want to be hurt again
Tutelary:
Darn lag is making me typo :(
Dr Watson:
Phil, I’d really like to speak to you in private. can you come to the bridge?
Guiun:
my, but there’s a lot of words today
Douglas Sharper:
What’s this about Watson?
Daedalus:
Phil–why do you trust Yeesha?
Brian Fioca:
He’s trying to get phil to meet with him in private, Douglas
Brian Fioca:
not sure why he can’t meet in public
phend:
knowlege is only limited perception of truth. and yes… only time will tell if there is truth
Tutelary:
Are you saying knowledge is less than truth, rather than truth less than knowledge?
Douglas Sharper:
What’s going on here?
phend:
knowlefge is less than truth
Guiun:
What would the point be, Brian?
Daedalus:
yes phil, you speak in riddles
phend:
you want to see me Dr. Watson?
Daedalus:
please be straightforward to us
Tutelary:
That’s a very controversial view. How do you support it? Truth is a part of knowledge. It is very hard to see how it can be anything more than it.]
Daedalus:
thats what establishes trust
Dr Watson:
Douglas, I’m interested in speaking with Phil about his experinces. Privately.
Brian Fioca:
why privately?
Tutelary:
Any truth is also knowledge, if it is know. If it is not known, then is it anything?
Douglas Sharper:
I’m interested in speaking with him as well. Privately.
Beatfox:
Tutelary: truth is constant, while knowledge is only what we know of that truth
phend:
truth is absolute - our understanding is not
Daedalus:
why can’t Phil tell all of us?
Douglas Sharper:
Phil, what are you doing?
Dr Watson:
yes, Phil come to the brige when you’re ready.
Tutelary:
Truth is not constant. At least not usually. Truth can come and go all the time.
phend:
okay, wait
Tutelary:
These are issues I certainly do not claim to know about. I just speculate wildly :P
Beatfox:
Tutelary, you appear to have a relativistic worldview. Am I right?
phend:
truth is what is true - it is what is behind, beneath all, what reality is built on
Tutelary:
I’m actually a hard determinist, so not really. But if I am wrong in my determinism, then I would have a relativistic view, especially of morals.
Beatfox:
Tute, do you believe that there is no constant truth at all?
phend:
but we only know pieces of truth - so knowlege is limited…
Beatfox:
I agree with you on that, Phil
phend:
…and belief is a combination of knowlege and faith - what we belive to be true…
Tutelary:
I’d not argue with that.
Daedalus:
but when we learn the truth, how do we know that it is the REAL truth?
Daedalus:
trust?
Douglas Sharper:
Who brought Plato and Aristotle out tonight?
Beatfox:
yes, many things can masquerade as truth
phend:
hello douglas
Douglas Sharper:
Phil - what’s going on up here?
Tutelary:
I prefer to think of myself as a spinoza rather than a plato :P
phend:
and i am only phil
Douglas Sharper:
spinoza - is that the italian ice cream?
Douglas Sharper:
Phil, are we leaving?
Tutelary:
And yet I find myself jealous of you phil, and what you have seen.
phend:
Dr. Watson - are you neadr the bridge?
Dr Watson:
I’m on the bridge, Phil, ready to meet with you.
Beatfox:
lol Doug
Tutelary:
A real pleasure talking to you Phil.
Guiun:
Equisilus, I agre.
Douglas Sharper:
Phil, what are you doing?
Douglas Sharper:
This isn’t a good idea.
phend:
thank you tutelary - i enjoyed it
Tutelary:
I hope philodophy doesn’t take a back east to history in the work to uncover the story of the d’ni.
phend:
hello Dr. Watson
Douglas Sharper:
I have a bad feeling here.
Victor Laxman:
/shout I’m here Dr. Watson. Is Sharper with you too?
Tutelary:
*back seat
Dr Watson:
hello, phend. how’ve you been?
Douglas Sharper:
Phil get out of here! Jump!
Beatfox:
Doug, what’s wrong?
Douglas Sharper:
C’mon
phend:
what?
Daedalus:
what the…
Douglas Sharper:
Phil…get away from them.
phend:
why is victor here?
Tutelary:
Douglas: We aren’r infectious…
Tutelary:
Annoying maybe… not infectious mthough.
phend:
douglas - what is wrong?
Douglas Sharper:
Phil, I’m telling you. Get over here and jump. Get away from Laxman and Watson.
Douglas Sharper:
I have a bad feeling.
Beatfox:
What’s all this about?
Douglas Sharper:
Follow me. Over here.
Douglas Sharper:
C’mon.
phend:
okay
Victor Laxman:
Douglas there’s no need to make a scene.
Dr Watson:
Phil, you should come with Laxman and me.
phend:
hey
Douglas Sharper:
Laxman, I know your game.
Douglas Sharper:
Phil, don’t go with them.
Al’my:
Phil run…, follow Douglas!
Victor Laxman:
My game? I assure you this is no game Douglas.
Douglas Sharper:
Exactly.
Tutelary:
I’ll go, with either of you… There Phil, much more trusting ;)
Douglas Sharper:
Phil, get away from them now!
phend:
i’m coming douglas

[Douglas Sharper jumps off the bridge]

Shawnzy:
I guess he jumped..
Dr Watson:
come with us, phil
Daedalus:
he jumped…
Victor Laxman:
Phil stop.
Brian Fioca:
don’t go with them
Al’my:
Phil run…
Daedalus:
phil…
phend:
hey! douglas?
Victor Laxman:
I’ll take that.

[Victor Laxman takes Phil’s Relto Book]

Pa’lua:
I guess I need glasses….I can’t see a thing.
Beatfox:
me neither
Dr Watson:
just come with us, Phil. Please.
Brian Fioca:
Victor…
phend:
no, give me that book - what….
Al’my:
Phil!
Guiun:
oooo! I hope they took his Relto book
Daedalus:
HEY!
Al’my:
nooo
Shawnzy:
heheh, Guiun
Guiun does a dance
Victor Laxman:
everything will be OK…just some questions
Brian Fioca:
don’t listen to him
Guiun:
It’s an intervention or something.
phend:
where…
Brian Fioca:
don’t force him to go anywhere
Beatfox:
Phil, they won’t harm you… don’t put up a fight
Guiun:
Give Phil some food. He’s too skinny.
Shawnzy:
Why not let Phil make his own choices?
Beatfox:
for your own good and for ours
Tutelary:
Is that force being used there?
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
What happened to Phil?
Beatfox:
they just want to understand what’s going on
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
He didn’t jump?
Beatfox:
they have no bad intentions
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
No, they take his book
Tutelary:
I suppose just asking doesn’t seem to get anyone anywhere…
phend:
why are you taking me? Ow!
Brian Fioca:
STOP
Victor Laxman:
sorry Phil. Just come with us.
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
They are doing something, but i can’t see…
Tutelary:
Let’s just hope the DRC don’t want a martyr on their hands…
Brian Fioca:
Why can’t you talk to him here?
Beatfox:
Phil, don’t try anything stupid… please
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
What the ???
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
This is bad!
Victor Laxman:
I hardly think this is the place for rational discourse.
Tutelary:
Wow, low blow.
Brian Fioca:
right, insult us
Brian Fioca:
and then forcibly abduct phil
Brian Fioca:
what next?
Beatfox:
Vicrot, surely you don’t mean what you just said
Beatfox:
Victor even
Dr Watson:
It’s ok, Phil. Let’s use this Book.
Tutelary:
They’ll do something really drastic, like take away our cones….
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
It’s very bad, they are taking him by the force
Victor Laxman:
give me your hand Phil.
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
They will pay for this.
phend:
why? no…
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
Dearly.
Brian Fioca:
NO!
Dr Watson:
You’re going to be fine, Phil.
Beatfox:
Victor, I hope for all our sake you know what you’re doing
phend:
nooooo…..

[Phil is linked away]

Tutelary:
No we shall see just how much power yeesha wields.
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
Dr. Watson is going to use the book
Brian Fioca:
We have to stop them!
Beatfox:
Tute, this is no time to start a rift
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
What book?
Brian Fioca:
we can’t! we don’t have access!
Tutelary:
*now
Brian Fioca:
I would if i could!
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
Phil’s relto book
Beatfox:
My gosh, people! What are we, a bunch of revolutionaries??
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
They are going to Phil’s Relto?
Beatfox:
We don’t even know anything!
Dr Watson:
Don’t worry, folks. No harm will come to Phil. We just need to speak with him.
Tutelary:
I don’t want to start a rift. As if I could do anything but widen it anyway.
Pa’lua:
Please take good care of Phil, Dr. Waston.
Brian Fioca:
how can we trust you? you are abducting him
Beatfox:
I have confidence in you, Dr. Watson.
Beatfox:
I konw you’ll do the right thing.
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
still not, they said that are going to use the book..
Tutelary:
Beat: You sound like you want to get started on relativism again ;)
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
Are they still in the city?
Beatfox:
I sincerely hope you don’t betray that confidence
Beatfox:
Tute: I trust the DRC, because I’ve seen everything they’ve been doing for us and I have a pretty darn good idea of their intentions
Beatfox:
I’m afraid I can’t say the same for Yeesha, et al
Beatfox:
yet
From Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
Is anyone there?
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
Dr. Watson and PHil are stinll in the city,
To Douglas Sharper in Douglas Sharper’s Relto:
sorry i’m laging a lot
Tutelary:
I trust Dr Watson, though not necessarily the DRC. Idon’t trust Yeesha, though I did enjoy talking to Phil.
Guiun:
Hello Groo
Pa’lua:
Hi Groo….you missed it.
From Douglas Sharper in Nexus:
What is your id?
Al’my:
my ki id is 171914
Al’my:
ups
To Douglas Sharper in Nexus:
my ki id is 171914
Al’my:
oups sorry.. i was in a pm..
Guiun:
they said they wanted to talk to him…then took his Relto book… then took him